Shao Huang
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
243
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Posted - 2013.05.29 23:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
Since I only have access to newbseye view I will offer that.
When you enter the game if you are paying attention you notice the Goon presence. I have played a lot of games that Goons are apparently in and they have never come to my attention in the way they did in EVE. So I started researching in the spirit of 'what the hell is that'? I read all the articles referenced here. I read all the criticisms and accounts of drama posted elsewhere.
The first thing I encountered was some of the assertions made in this thread about the us/them elitism and pubbie hate. Related to that was the phenomena of a community of players that came in tact, more or less, into a game with something about this dynamic already present. Gamers often seek to create this in games anyway. The primary distinction being a way of playing the game and efficacy associated with that play style, valued in different ways. It creates a kind of game within the game for them. The rest of game play is interacted with through this. Organizational skill and understanding for the mechanics of some sort are often the distinguishing factors, whether it is some elite team in fps, guild in themepark, etc. What is valued and how that is done varies greatly. The reasons for the 'other' being the ignorant, heathenistic, baby eating villains also vary greatly.
I got interested in the coming from SA part and started reading SA. I am a stupid old dude and parts of the culture are simply impenetrable to me. It is a culture however. I am now regularly active in about 5 threads and have read many others many of which contain a vast array of information and arguments on subjects directly pertinent to my work and the condition of the planet. Unless argument from authority and ad hominem, etc. are artfully and amusingly done, there is very little tolerance for these sorts of things. The attention span is longer than 15 minutes. People read entire books, articles and book length threads in order to participate in a conversation. I am now participating there as a result of EVE in ways that have so far been very useful to me, rather than participaning in EVE as a result of SA in a way that is useful here.
The EVE thread itself is not markedly different form a game thread you would find anywhere, from a self described group of players playing a game some specific way. They talk about mechanics of all the different parts of their game play, granted at a fairly superficial level given that it is pretty public. That private public split is not uncommon for any such group of players. Much of it is about people wanting to be Goons and variously getting advice, told to go away, various forms of hazing, etc.
Corey- your argument seems flawed to me. Goons are in fact part of the game. Is the game about inclusion, as you say? I don't know if it is about inclusion or not, but your argument is off. What it seems like is you just don't like Goons or the way they play the game. That is a different matter and completely your perogative. They create a particular boundary in the game that gives it meaning for them in various ways. So do you. In fact, Goons as other constitute part of your boundary condition n almost exactly the same way the 'pubbies' constitute an asserted boundary condition for Goons.
I also notice that they seem to have the most organized, emergent form of introducing new players to the game in the game. It seems better than CCPs, though Goonlets apparently use that too.
Personally I don't have much interest in joining, but this is because I am a Marxist: "I don't want to belong to any club that would accept people like me as a member". Groucho Marx telegram to the Friars Club.
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